Editor’s Note: Due to the high level of reader interest in the story posted earlier this morning on Inside Vero describing an exchange between utility activist Glenn Heran and Councilwoman Amelia Graves, we are presenting the full text of the dialogue which took place between Heran, Graves, and Mayor Richard Winger Tuesday.
Heran: Craig, we know where you stand. We’ve known where you stood all along. You are for the sale, and you also know FMPA is the problem. Pilar, we know where you stand. You’ve always been for the sale. Jay, we know where you stand. The only question left on this particular Council is, we know we have two solid supporters of the sale. The only question remaining, Mr. Winger, Mr. (sic) Graves, Mrs. (sic) Graves, where do you stand?
I know you said in your platform, I know you came to the Taxpayers’ Association last year, and as a part of your platform you said, “This is a done deal, and this is between Florida Power & Light and the FMPA.”
One of my questions was, well, it’s actually between the City of Vero Beach and the FMPA. Where do you stand on that? And so my comment to you is, it’s not enough for platitudes, it is not enough to say that you are for the sale, if you don’t do anything to defend us from the FMPA, if you don’t do anything to get us past this final hurdle. Leadership in this community understands that they (FMPA) are the problem and you must defend us from the FMPA. Your choice is to capitulate to the FMPA and kill the sale. So again I ask you both, are you with us in supporting the sale and getting us out of the FMPA?
Winger: Ms. Graves doesn’t have to answer, you can direct questions to me, and she can answer if she wishes. I wrote in my comments two weeks ago, it is much the best solution we could have. I mean, we need to make the sale happen. That is my only reason of taking the risk of trying to make it happen, and what I’ve said before is accurate. The agreements that we have that are the problem were signed by the City, not by Florida Power & Light, or anyone else. Someone earlier said it, and I though it was kind of interesting, I don’t think the City has been engaged enough in finding a solution to those agreements, quite frankly. I mean, we’ve put it off on Florida Power & Light. So, I’m absolutely for it. What I would do is get it sold, and I would take the working capital and I would defease the pension, and life goes on in Vero Beach without any significant effects to services or taxes. I won’t say none. I could never say that. So, I don’t have any question it’s the better solution. However, it takes FMPA and Florida Power & Light, it takes an agreement, and it takes us satisfying whatever it takes to make that happen. I can’t assure you, and I don’t know what it takes to do that. I just simply don’t.
Heran: I think it is more indicative that we are looking for your position that you will defend us against the FMPA. It’s not just, “I support the sale, and we’ll see how it goes.” I mean, we know where two of the Council members stand. They are fighting for the public to get away from this organization. And I think you have to have that kind of commitment if you are going to get through this deal.
Winger: Mr. Heran, I think, having studied the file, and I’ve studied all the contracts and I do believe that it is possible to complete the sale, but I can’t assure you that will happen. I just don’t know. And I will do what I can. That is all I can tell you.
Heran: I certainly wish you well. Mrs. Graves, did you want to respond?
Graves: Ms. Graves, thank you. I’m with the Mayor on this, and as far as defending from the FMPA, I don’t know what it is you are looking for. Do you want me to go stand in the street and shout, because that is essentially what a lot of people are doing right now, and that’s now getting us any closer to finishing this process.
Heran: What are you going to do?
Graves: I am going to follow the Mayor’s direction. He is going in April to meet with the FMPA, and he is going to come back and report back to this Council after than meeting and tell us what’s going on. Then we’ll know from there where we need to go. But, you know, I’m sorry these things aren’t happening on your time line. I’m sorry they are not happening on the entire community’s time line. Obviously, this has been a lot harder than anyone thought. I mean, the reality is this was supposed to happen in January of this year and it didn’t. You have all of these experts working on this. We’re spending all of this money to get it done, and no one seems to be able to come up with any answers. So, what do you think it is I could do singularly that all of these experts and these large organizations haven’t been able to pull off.
Heran: Is that what you want to tell the public?
Graves: I’m asking you. What do you think it is?
Heran: Your job, your job is to defend us. Your job is to try to execute the sale.
Graves: My job is to represent the votes of Vero Beach.
Heran: (Interrupting) And what did they say, what did the voters…
Graves: Mr. Heran, I am asking you to let me finish speaking.
Heran: Please.
Graves: My job is to represent the voters of Vero Beach. My job is not to be emotional, and accuse people of things. It’s to gather facts. And right now, that’s what we are doing. That’s what they Mayor’s is trying to accomplish. That’s what everyone is trying to accomplish here. And that is my answer. I’m not going to be bullied or strong-armed into saying what it is you want to hear.
Heran: Inerrupting…
Winger: Now wait a minute, Mr. Heran. This has gone far enough. She’s stated her position. You asked it. We’re through.
Heran: Well, I wish you well, Mr. Winger.
Winger: Not only wish, pray. The reality is we have a difficult situation.
Heran: No question about it. The point I am trying to make is you must be committed to getting us out of the FMPA, and I don’t hear that from you, Mrs. (sic) Graves.
Winger: Now wait I minute. I’m going to cut that off. I think I heard it, and I am committed. So let’s let it go at that.
Indian River Guardian 
Mr Heran’s final comments not recorded were “but Mayor Winger and (mr,mrs,ms) Graves if the voters of the city know all the true facts as you want, they will learn what a gross miscarriage of the public trust these past city councils have been. So I beg you no concrete facts PLEASE. PS: have you seen my plan where the city profits $156,500,00 with no tax increase, even a tax decrease and $625.00 for every citizen of the city? Oh for the good olde days”.
What’s next a mud wrestling match, This dialogue has reached a level of school yard kids yelling at each other. I think Mr. Heran is a bully, is this the same guy that made the 150 million dollar rounding error. I believe Ms Graves is mistaken when she states that we have experts working on this, surely she is not mistaken the transactional attorney as experts in the complex field of sales and acquistions of electrical utilities. Vero Beach has taken a submissive role in this transaction from the beginning, because they did not have the required expertise (it’s not to late). Maybe Ms. Graves has set a new tone for the reasonable members of the council to follow. ” I’m not taking your BS anymore”. Maybe you can hire a sargent at arms, I hear Mike Tyson is looking for work.
I thought Mr. O’Connor was hired as City Manager because it was believed he had experience with utility sales. I thought the transactional attorneys were hired because they were adept in this kind of thing. I thought Mrs. Turner & Mrs. Carroll were also supposedly acutely aware of the many difficulties of this transactions – and certainly FMPA has no obligation to lie down and roll over for us or for anyone else. If it’s a matter of who the heck can negotiate without getting overly emotional and sounding like a darned idiot, I wouldn’t vote for Mr. Wilson or Mr. Heran – if they were even considered in the loop. That “plan” Mr. Heran brought to the table to get us all kinds of money failed to include the steps involving FMPA, apparently…..and maybe a few other items. The strategy has not been exactly tip-top but I believe this Council has the best chance of seeing this through if it is to be completed. And I congratulate Ms Graves for her grit….and Mr. Winger for being as generous toward Mr. Heran as he was but cutting him off when it was obvious he was trying to wear them down–to get a commitment–no matter what that might end up costing us in the long run.
There is no excuse for any public official to have to take the verbal abuse that Mr Heran directed towards Ms Graves. He ought to read a very old , but good book titled HOW TO WIN FRIENDS AND INFLUENCE PEOPLE . His bully tactics did not work on Ms Graves . Not only was she ladylike and professional through out his cajoling ; she gave honest answers which in the recent past were a rarity. Maybe FPL could take a few lessons from this same book . It looks as if FPL has dug a deep , cavernous hole for themselves and are begging for the city to dig them out from under the debris that they have caused. I think Mr Heran made a Freudian slip of the tongue when he said, “….get us past this final hurdle” His desperation is showing ; does he know or think the entire deal is dead? I wonder.
As a city council person it’s the responsibility of Amelia Graves to serve the citizens of Vero Beach
by researching “all” issues. She knows diddly squat of the utility transaction, any of it. Obviously with her statements, she’s following the lead of Richard Winger. Now, that’s weak and unprofessional!
The poor thing is out of place in her position.
Glenn Heran was attempting to gauge her position. Nothing wrong with that. If Winger doesn’t have the leadership to conduct a meeting properly I say pity, pity citizens of Vero Beach.
Kramer was hooping and hollering, almost jumped over the dais. It was hysterical. What a show!
Rosemarie, Amelia has shown poise, depth and judgment – three qualities which have alluded you. Further, Amelia is far, far, far more knowledgable about the realities of the utility sale that you have ever been or are likely to ever be.